The topic was how technology has changed our libraries. I have edited out most of the talking donut dialog :)
Technology & Donuts
2007-02-13
[18:04] Lebachai Vesta: This is even less formal than our regular meetings, so please feel free to chime in!
[18:05] Lebachai Vesta: the topic tonight is a discussion of how technology has affected libraries
[18:05] Lebachai Vesta: just out of curiousity, how many of you have IT-related jobs?
[18:05] Uskala Hidayat: I do
[18:05] Treblid Lassard: I do
[18:05] Dinnie Devonshire: I do
[18:05] Glen Yao: I do too
[18:05] Elaine Tulip: IT within high school librarie
[18:06] BruceF Wildcat: yep
[18:06] Nick Ulich: I do
[18:06] Lebachai Vesta: ok, so around half or so? Good mix
[18:06] Lebachai Vesta: Anybody's job NOT affected by technology in a significant way?
[18:06] Lebachai Vesta: <dead silence except for donuts>
[18:07] Lebachai Vesta: ok, I sort of figured ;) What have been some of the biggest changes in your libraries that technology has brought about?
[18:07] You: That should tell you something....
[18:07] Elaine Tulip: online databases replacing some print
[18:08] Ilene Pratt: I guess it's like... since when? It's been creeping up on us. We got our first online catalog in 1986.
[18:08] You: Metadata expanding exponentially beyond cataloging!
[18:08] Emerald Dumont is Online
[18:08] Nick Ulich: Less students coming into the library
[18:08] Chocolate Donut : Mmmm..
[18:08] Infinite Brevity: For me it has changed what I do to prepare to provide services
[18:08] Uskala Hidayat: Endeca
[18:08] Ilene Pratt: We don't have less students coming to the library.
[18:08] Cylindrian Rutabaga is Online
[18:08] Chocolate Donut : That was delicious, Alphonsus Peck!
[18:08] Dinnie Devonshire: Some staff members forging ahead, others stressed and falling behind
[18:09] Treblid Lassard: Different kinds of classes offered to Patrons
[18:09] Nick Ulich: People wanting instant information
[18:09] BruceF Wildcat: the nature and means of communication with patrons
[18:09] Ilene Pratt: Yes, we're using conferencing software to do instruction fror some distance learners.
[18:09] Lebachai Vesta: Do you find that expectations of people coming in have changed?
[18:10] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Patrons who aren't willing to learn any new technology, but expect us to know it all.
[18:10] Treblid Lassard: More T1's!
[18:10] Ilene Pratt: Yes, no one wants to use a print journal! They act surprised that we have'em ;)
[18:10] Lebachai Vesta: And T3's
[18:10] Infinite Brevity: Expectations have definitely changed. Especially concerning what kind of help they want from us.
[18:10] Lebachai Vesta: How so, Infinite?
[18:11] Infinite Brevity: They no longer just want information, but training on how to use computers, web, etc...
[18:11] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Just the opposite at my library.
[18:11] Lebachai Vesta: Hi Willow
[18:11] Willow Kindley: hello!
[18:11] Lebachai Vesta: How is it opposite, Moonbeamdance?
[18:12] Moonbeamdance Northmead: People don't want to do anything for themselves.... they even expect us to fill out online forms for them.
[18:12] Lebachai Vesta: wow
[18:12] Infinite Brevity: Another big change was at my previous library where we created an information commons.
[18:12] Treblid Lassard: We experienced a little bit of that but most of it has past now
[18:13] Nick Ulich: The expectation that everything is available online is pretty prevalent
[18:13] Lebachai Vesta: I am wondering how libraries got to a place where we became the hand-holders for computer learning?
[18:13] Glen Yao: we are going thrgouh a new building project, and people say we don't need space because everything is going online. but...
[18:14] Glen Yao: but most of our space needs are because of the demand for technology
[18:14] Lebachai Vesta: right, Glen..computers and server take up space too
[18:14] Willow Kindley: bill gates assisted in making us the bridge over the digital divide.
[18:14] Lebachai Vesta: Good point, Willow
[18:15] Ilene Pratt: And at our place everyone's up against the walls trying to get to electrical outlets for their laptops
[18:15] Willow Kindley: we are the providers of information and technologically aided information access kind of falls under our umbrella.
[18:15] Nick Ulich: :)
[18:15] Dinnie Devonshire: Id say two reasons: we are looked to as "authorities" by those who use libraries, and we are often the first to adopt the new technologies in a place that is visible to the public.
[18:15] Infinite Brevity: The electrical outlets are also a problem in our library
[18:15] Milosun Czervik is Offline
[18:15] Bryndal Ellison accepted your inventory offer.
[18:15] Dinnie Devonshire: Thats why we hand-hold.
[18:15] Percival Ogg is Online
[18:16] Moonbeamdance Northmead: I work at two libraries, and both have trouble with wireless, it's a lot of headache.
[18:16] Glen Yao: people need to realize that, not everyone ahs a PC yet, and those who don't ... come to the library expecting to use ours
[18:16] Willow Kindley: can anyone remember their first computer experiences?
[18:16] Talarus Luan accepted your inventory offer.
[18:16] Alphonsus Peck: Very simple. People have technology and don't know how to use it. Libraries have always been free sources for info.l
[18:16] Alphonsus Peck: And we have the technology they need
[18:16] Lebachai Vesta: yes, I thought the TRS-80 was an eletronic typwriter :)
[18:16] Treblid Lassard: I can it was an Apple IIc
[18:16] Nick Ulich: Mine was with punch cards and having to wait until 3 am for the techs to run it Willow
[18:16] bucky Barkley is Online
[18:16] Infinite Brevity: I remember the first time I used an Infotrac film reader
[18:17] Willow Kindley: and it is a little frightening to be learning such a "foreign" mode of interacting.
[18:17] Willow Kindley: i didn't know how i could possibly remember all the things i was learning. i felt very lost.
[18:17] Lebachai Vesta: Does anyone find that they are doing more or less computer training as the Internet grows in popularity?
[18:17] Willow Kindley: i try to remember that when the retirees come in to learn how to use email or find information or shop online.
[18:18] Nick Ulich: We have regular computer workshops
[18:18] Dinnie Devonshire: I'm not sure it is more, but the nature of the training has changed.
[18:18] Treblid Lassard: Our computer classes have doubled in number and the request list is growing
[18:18] Infinite Brevity: I'm wondering, how many people here are from public libraries?
[18:18] Lebachai Vesta: How so, DInnie?
[18:18] Lebachai Vesta: I'm from a PL, Infinite
[18:18] Moonbeamdance Northmead: We have been trying for two years to teach our retirees with computer classes. No one has ever come.
[18:18] Treblid Lassard: PL
[18:18] Willow Kindley: i am from a PL, and we don't have enough places to accommodate all the potential students we have.
[18:18] Glen Yao: we are doing more classes and I am finding even the staff need a lot more training
[18:18] Moonbeamdance Northmead: I'm public as well as academic.
[18:18] Glen Yao: PL
[18:19] Selene Colasanti: I'm a high school libarian.
[18:19] Elaine Tulip: I'm K-12
[18:19] Donut Plate (L): Yum ! Sugar-glazed, Willow Kindley, always great with coffee !
[18:19] BruceF Wildcat: library school ;)
[18:19] Dinnie Devonshire: Well, the change came with the Internet. Before, we had databases inhouse and there was access to them. Then, with the INternet, all of a sudden there were many more resources with various protocols for access, etc. and folks began to get confused. Thus, the training needed to change.
[18:19] Nick Ulich: Law school library
[18:19] Max Batra: I'm at an academic library
[18:19] Uskala Hidayat: Work in a university lab in the library.
[18:19] Ilene Pratt: Yes! I remember the first computer I bought -I'm at an academic
[18:20] Infinite Brevity: Do patrons really know the difference from inhouse resources and those we subscribe to over the web?
[18:20] Gamay Nouvelle accepted your inventory offer.
[18:20] Gamay Nouvelle accepted your inventory offer.
[18:20] Lebachai Vesta: Moonbeamdance, our library found that for seniors we had to go to them, because they wouldn't often come to us
[18:20] BruceF Wildcat: Should they need to?
[18:20] Gamay Nouvelle accepted your inventory offer.
[18:20] Treblid Lassard: ours don't but that is intentional
[18:20] Max Batra: patrons don't care
[18:20] Rebekah Cavan is Online
[18:20] Nick Ulich: Same here Treblid
[18:20] Lebachai Vesta: They shouldn't care--it should be seamless
[18:21] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Ours comes to us, they just want immediate help, no classes.
[18:21] Max Batra: yep
[18:21] Willow Kindley: with some of the linker-type programs people don't really need to differentiate.
[18:21] Infinite Brevity: I mention it only because when something goes wrong with a resources, we are blamed for it even if it is out of our control
[18:21] Dinnie Devonshire: There is no difference, and they should not care, true. But before the INternet the protocols for access were quite different. Remember searching DOS-based data files and such?. Not the same as tof=day with graphical UIs etc.
[18:21] Max Batra: unfortunately there are so many user interfaces use can't be intuitive
[18:22] Ilene Pratt: So you all think that all information is the same? magazines? peer-reviewed academic journals? web sites by junior high students? I mean... what do you all mean by "seamless"?
[18:22] Fabio Medby accepted your inventory offer.
[18:22] Lebachai Vesta: I remember it was only a couple years ago when I got a call from a librarian asking me to fix Yahoo or some such site
[18:22] Dinnie Devonshire: :)
[18:22] Infinite Brevity: lol
[18:22] Moonbeamdance Northmead: hehe
[18:22] Max Batra: yes, the browser is also the Internet
[18:22] Treblid Lassard: we get that too
[18:22] Lebachai Vesta: When I can do that, I'll be working for Bill Gates ;)
[18:22] Nick Ulich: Looks like you fixed it. lol
[18:22] Treblid Lassard: and Wallpapers are screensavers
[18:23] Willow Kindley: I am sure we all know the differences and we can try to share that information, but it is not always as important to our patrons.
[18:23] Treblid Lassard: but there is only so much you can do
[18:23] Lebachai Vesta: Ilene, what I mean by seamless is that the patron shouldn't have to understand the source to get the information
[18:23] Percival's Short Bench: Right click me and choose 'Sit Here' to sit down
[18:23] Ilene Pratt: Itt's VERY important to patrons at the universtiy. Students need to learn to make distinctions!
[18:23] Max Batra: in an ideal world
[18:23] Infinite Brevity: Sometimes I get myself all caught up in trying to explain the details and then realize what I'm doing and stop
[18:23] Lebachai Vesta: For instance, we have licensed databases from the state, from our consortium and then ones we buy just for our library
[18:23] Max Batra: but not yet
[18:23] Lebachai Vesta: The patron shouldn't have to know which is which in order to use them
[18:23] Treblid Lassard: They need to know the source of the info but they don't need to know the site they are searching is not hosted by the library
[18:24] Elaine Tulip: at our school district, we face issues that not all of our librarians are tech leaders in their schools
[18:24] Elaine Tulip: we have collaborated with a local university for special tech training coursework for school librarians
[18:25] Willow Kindley: we do have classes that teach patrons how to determine the validity of a web site.
[18:25] Infinite Brevity: You know, with technology changing so quickly, it can be easy to feel left behind
[18:25] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Did that work Elaine?
[18:25] Uskala Hidayat: Many library science students are tech adverse.
[18:25] Max Batra: yikes!
[18:25] Elaine Tulip: we are just getting started...much interest
[18:25] Lebachai Vesta: Technology changes every 5 minutes. Even techs feel left behind sometimes, even if they don't always admit it
[18:25] You: Boy that's a recipe for stagnation!
[18:25] Moonbeamdance Northmead: And, who an afford to keep up with all the technology?
[18:25] Ann Enigma is Online
[18:25] Uskala Hidayat: Hey, i sit next to them every day.
[18:25] Elaine Tulip: it seems only possible to be an expert in some areas
[18:25] BruceF Wildcat: In our survey of students beginning the LIS at U Arizona, 85% had never made a web page/site.
[18:26] Lebachai Vesta: Wow, BruceF
[18:26] Sharkie Carmona: Well, when i was in library school over 30 years ago was tech adverse too...even actively resisted it
[18:26] You: Oh...yeah...well, neither had I when I strted my program...
[18:26] Elaine Tulip: our k-12 librarians get frustrated that they do not have tech support equitably and admin access to computers
[18:26] Ilene Pratt: And library science students all say they "love books" :)
[18:26] Infinite Brevity: Wow that is a higher percentage than I would have expected
[18:26] BruceF Wildcat: librarians who got their degree before 1993 got it before the web was invented.
[18:27] Uskala Hidayat: Exactly, do bibliophiles mix well with tech.
[18:27] Ilene Pratt: that's me! The pc didn't exist!
[18:27] Sharkie Carmona: I got mine even before the micro was invented!
[18:27] Max Batra: I got my degree in 1972
[18:27] Moonbeamdance Northmead: So, who should be teaching all this, and when? High schools? Community colleges? Public libraries?
[18:27] Willow Kindley: i didn't make a web page until lis school.
[18:27] Lucifer Baphomet is Online
[18:27] BruceF Wildcat: However, the majority of students under 30 do tech however. Perhaps they don't consider a myspace page making a web page.
[18:27] Dinnie Devonshire: I think we have to remember that the coming up generation is much more plugged in than we ever were.
[18:28] Uskala Hidayat: Libraries will be on the front lines whether they want to or not.
[18:28] Willow Kindley: i do think that there may come a time when technology-based information and analog-type information and services will need separate arenas.
[18:28] Lebachai Vesta: I am wondering if things like MySpace add to the seamlessness of the tech culture...people just learn how to do it because it is part of regular life
[18:28] Elaine Tulip: but, many of our older librarians have dedicated themselves to changing with the times
[18:28] Glen Yao: I think we all ahve to work together or there will always be people behind
[18:28] Dinnie Devonshire: They are making pages on MySpace, and doing videos on YouTube. They are more adept at this than some of us, even :)
[18:28] BruceF Wildcat: Access to tech is changing, so you don't have to be a coder to put up sites, or take advantage of social software.
[18:28] Willow Kindley: as a culture - it seems all librarians are more than willing to move with the tides of change.
[18:28] Ilene Pratt: What do you learn when you put up a page on MySpace? What skills does it take?
[18:29] BruceF Wildcat: Our students are podcasting LIS lectures and putting CE/PD events on youtube.
[18:29] Elaine Tulip: there is a focus on tech related to information literacy
[18:29] Dinnie Devonshire: Well, I am about to retire and I'm still going strong in the IT world!
[18:29] Ilene Pratt: Dinnie, me too!
[18:29] Lebachai Vesta: Good for you both!
[18:29] Infinite Brevity: I've noticed a lot more collaborations between school librarians, public, and university in the literature
[18:29] Willow Kindley: one of ranganathan's five laws is that the library is a living organism - and an organism must renew itself to live.
[18:30] Elaine Tulip: we are definitely invested in collaborating with public libraries and universitite
[18:30] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Chime melody
[18:30] BruceF Wildcat: When students put up a myspace page, they learn communication. Tech shouldn't get in the way of that.
[18:31] Elaine Tulip: in k-12, we face the issue that MySpace, You Tube, and similar sites are blocked
[18:31] Elaine Tulip: often due to bandwidth issues
[18:31] Moonbeamdance Northmead: I've heard that some public libraries won't allow access to myspace.
[18:31] Dinnie Devonshire: We have that problem in government libraries also.
[18:31] Lebachai Vesta: That's sad
[18:31] Rebekah Cavan: it's not allowed at my public library
[18:31] Nick Ulich: How many of you have done myspace pages for your library?
[18:31] Rebekah Cavan: We don't allow chat
[18:31] Dinnie Devonshire: I have special permission to access SL during the day, for instance.
[18:31] Elaine Tulip: so the tech students need is not available in schoools
[18:31] Rebekah Cavan: It seems very odd
[18:31] BruceF Wildcat: Perhaps instead of blocking it, we should be helping them put them up.
[18:31] BrianA Corleone is Offline
[18:31] Rebekah Cavan: exactly
[18:31] BruceF Wildcat: That is a much more effective way to introduce information literacy and information ethics.
[18:32] Sharkie Carmona: What is the reason for blocking my space?
[18:32] Treblid Lassard: That idea had been kicked around in our Pl too but it was eventually thrown out on the basis that you can find the same stuff on Yahoo
[18:32] Infinite Brevity: I'm at a university and we create user groups within Facebook
[18:32] Dinnie Devonshire: Well, I think that, with government, it is not recognized that these channels are going to become more prevalent.
[18:32] Dinnie Devonshire: And useful.
[18:32] Glen Yao: we just got a myspace page... I think people paniac about it, but all people need is education not censorship
[18:32] Rebekah Cavan: AT my library, myspace is blocked for a couple of reasons...
[18:32] Gabrielle Riel is Online
[18:32] Rebekah Cavan: one is because people are overreacting to the possibility of sex offenders reaching kids
[18:32] Max Batra: I thought Facebook didn't allow noneppeerson accounts
[18:32] Willow Kindley: i think i saw on the charlotte pl site that they are using myspace for their teen portion of the site.
[18:33] Rebekah Cavan: the other is because kids chatting take up all the computers
[18:33] Rebekah Cavan: There are lots of libraries with myspace pages. Some have worked past the paranoia
[18:33] Sharkie Carmona: I would like to look at a public library my space site...any recommendations?
[18:33] Elaine Tulip: there seems to be a widening gap between the technology students need and what is available at k-12 schools
[18:33] Nick Ulich: I did a myspace page for our library to communicate with our students
[18:33] Ilene Pratt: One of our communications professors pointed out that they said the same thing when the telepone was invented... People were going to call their daughters and get them to leave the house.
[18:34] Rebekah Cavan: I can't think of one right now and my browser's not open, but you should be able to do a search on "library"
[18:34] Treblid Lassard: It's amazing how things cycle
[18:34] Rebekah Cavan: in myspace
[18:34] Glen Yao: and why should we let adults chat and not kids??
[18:34] Sharkie Carmona: I wanted to see a really good one...
[18:34] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Good point Glen.
[18:34] Rebekah Cavan: We don't allow adults to chat either. It's like we're living in the 90's : )
[18:35] Willow Kindley: http://www.plcmc.org/Teens/
[18:35] You: New technolgies are always a problem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRjVeRbhtRU
[18:35] Glen Yao: we sue the same reasoning for games like runescape... why can adults play games ,but not kids... so we stopped filtering them.
[18:36] Glen Yao: most of the time the problems are behavior related, not technolgy related
[18:36] Treblid Lassard: we had to block runescape kids were throwing chairs
[18:36] Dinnie Devonshire: I find that there is also a problem when the IT people have not even tried the channel and dont understand what it is about. That puts clamps on a lot of things that should be more open.
[18:36] Infinite Brevity: I think the complaint about MySpace was that anyone could get to the pages. That is why Facebook is expanding into High Schools.
[18:36] Percival's Short Bench: Right click me and choose 'Sit Here' to sit down
[18:36] Rebekah Cavan: But myspace is like anything else: librarians aren't supposed to act as parents
[18:36] Nick Ulich: Facebook is now abailable outside of schools in certain areas
[18:36] Treblid Lassard: Agreed
[18:36] Lebachai Vesta: I can speak only somewhat for IT people, but sometimes the reasons can be valid...or not
[18:37] Glen Yao: people can only get to them if you set it to public... make it private and it only can me seen by friends "education"
[18:37] Rebekah Cavan: Does anyone here use IM for reference questions?
[18:37] Infinite Brevity: But in Facebook, you can limit access to your network (school)
[18:37] Ilene Pratt: Isnt' some of the restrictions because we have limited resources?
[18:37] Uskala Hidayat: I have.
[18:37] Lebachai Vesta: Yes, Ilene, bandwidth can be a big concern with things like YouTube
[18:37] Infinite Brevity: We provide IM reference at our library (university)
[18:37] Treblid Lassard: We are working on implementing it right now
[18:37] Willow Kindley: i do
[18:37] BruceF Wildcat: Many academic libraries use chat for reference, especially for help with the library site and services.
[18:38] Rebekah Cavan: Did you get a lot of resistance from librarians who didn't know how to IM?
[18:38] Willow Kindley: it is really fun when a whole class of students all ring in together!
[18:38] Glen Yao: bandwidth is another issue, if you limit everyone then you are not discrimating
[18:38] Emerald Dumont is Offline
[18:38] BruceF Wildcat: Librarians need to learn how to IM ;)
[18:38] Infinite Brevity: Our IM Reference is being done by a limited number of librarians
[18:38] Max Batra: same here
[18:39] Lebachai Vesta: we have a statewide reference service that uses proprietary chat...so the concept isn't new at least to many in our state
[18:39] Ilene Pratt: Good point! We don't all have to know how to do everything. We can be a team
[18:39] Willow Kindley: we all take turns with chat (as we call it) and some enjoy it and others don't.
[18:39] Sharkie Carmona: Do reference librarians IM when they are on the reference desk?
[18:39] Nick Ulich: We do
[18:39] Lebachai Vesta: Some do
[18:39] Takver Twin is Offline
[18:39] Ilene Pratt: Sometimes we have to do chat at the desk - Its not a great idea. Hard if you get a real live patron in front of you.
[18:40] Willow Kindley: we do 1-1/2 to 2 hour shifts on desk, on phone, on chat, off desk...
[18:40] Dinnie Devonshire: We do chat, not IM, but chat is scheduled separately from the ref desk.
[18:40] Lorelei Junot is Offline
[18:40] Sharkie Carmona: So, practically speaking, who do you deal with first--live patron or live IM?
[18:40] Infinite Brevity: Not all of the time. Some are in offices during the day. Then at night the reference desk takes over
[18:40] Lebachai Vesta: I think it's harder to ignore the person in front of you
[18:41] Justy Reymont is Offline
[18:41] Ilene Pratt: Ify ou are i n the mddle of a chat though you have to finish it.
[18:41] Willow Kindley: we always have someone at each area, but a patron at the desk takes precedence over all other.
[18:41] Infinite Brevity: Definitely the in person person (huh) at our library
[18:41] Lebachai Vesta: it's a dilemma for many in our statewide VR service, that are doing it out on the floor
[18:41] Ilene Pratt: And chat can take like... forever!
[18:41] Willow Kindley: you can tell a person in chat that you have to answer a phone or see what someone wants.
[18:41] Sharkie Carmona: Maybe people are getting used to others multi-tasking and are ok with waiting.
[18:42] Liatris Tidewater: I think if you tell them it will take a minute, they are more patient
[18:42] Willow Kindley: usually a person on a computer asking you a question IS multi-tasking.
[18:42] Infinite Brevity: I think as long as you communicate to the people what you are doing, most are understanding
[18:42] Ilene Pratt: I would never do that - If I"m in a transaction, I figure I'm supposed to take care of that
[18:42] Treblid Lassard: More and more people are multi-tasking as it is so the person who is IMing is probably doing something else as well
[18:42] BruceF Wildcat: wear headphones and mumble incoherently... They'll think you're talking to someone and will wait til you're done ;)
[18:42] Lebachai Vesta: LOL
[18:43] Sharkie Carmona: This is true...when I am on a computer and on the phone on hold, I am usually composing an email ro something..
[18:43] Ilene Pratt: That's no reason to assume that they want to wait around while you take on another question!
[18:43] Treblid Lassard: that is true, so you still have to ask
[18:43] Infinite Brevity: I usually treat a chat request the way I would a phone call to the desk
[18:44] Selene Colasanti: Thanks for the good info. Sorry, I have to go. Glad to see so many librarians & guybrarians here!
[18:44] Willow Kindley: bye.
[18:44] Lebachai Vesta: By Selene, thanks for stopping by!
[18:44] Ilene Pratt: I'm worried that "Multitasking" is excuse for crappy customer service and lack of administrative support to get the job done properly
[18:44] Znetlady Isbell is Offline
[18:45] Lebachai Vesta: I think that's a legit concern, Ilene...but I will also say that I am one of those people who constantly multitask
[18:45] Infinite Brevity: That is a very legitimate worry Ilene
[18:45] BruceF Wildcat: It's just a matter of taking turns, if you have to handle f2f, chat and phone all at the same time. Smiles help.
[18:45] Nick Ulich: /sit
[18:45] Treblid Lassard: You're right it is not an excuse for crappy cust. service but it is definatly something that we have to consider in this wired world
[18:45] Takver Twin is Online
[18:45] Flying mat 1 whispers: Say '/stand' to stop sitting on the ground.
[18:45] Infinite Brevity: Pearly whites do help
[18:45] Willow Kindley: well, really, the question was hypothetical. we are not proposing that we interrupt our reference transactions. it was a what-if and what would you do if.
[18:45] Uskala Hidayat: Is reference really that relevant when Endeca can make the information so much more accessible?
[18:46] Sharkie Carmona: Endeca?
[18:46] Ilene Pratt: Huh? YOu mean Endeca users don't have any questions?
[18:46] Uskala Hidayat: Yes, haven't you kept up with what is happening at the NC State Library.
[18:46] Dinnie Devonshire: Yes, reference is relevant. Endeca, or any other catalogue, does not satisfy all the users needs.
[18:46] Liatris Tidewater: we're about to implement it state wide in FL, too
[18:47] Willow Kindley: people all have different learning styles and needs, so even if we have everything available in a digital format, there will be those that need to obtain their information through a person-to-person medium.
[18:47] Uskala Hidayat: Tell that to Home Depot or Barnes & Noble.
[18:47] Dinnie Devonshire: Endeca is a useful new paradign for helping the user find things in the catalogue, but reference is not only about the catalogue.
[18:47] Treblid Lassard: I am a card carring geek and sometimes I would rather talk to a person than search a computer though. Those times are getting fewer but it still happens
[18:47] Ilene Pratt: Yes, and I likek Endeca, but I can't imagine it's going to mean no reference questions!
[18:47] Uskala Hidayat: Endeca has really changed things at NC State.
[18:47] Infinite Brevity: Didn't we think our web pages would answer a lot of questions for our patrons?
[18:48] Uskala Hidayat: The faculty is wild about it.
[18:48] Ilene Pratt: It's cut down on questions?
[18:48] Glen Yao: same here, and I usual expect a faster answer if I am face to face
[18:48] Percival's Short Bench: Right click me and choose 'Sit Here' to sit down
[18:48] Percival's Short Bench: Right click me and choose 'Sit Here' to sit down
[18:48] Donut Plate (L): Mmmm, good selection, Nick Ulich !
[18:49] Dinnie Devonshire: But we find that with more web pages and catalogues available, the reference questions may be growing fewer, but the questions are becoming more difficult.
[18:49] Vulpine Eldrich is Online
[18:49] Lebachai Vesta: I agree Dinnie, because people can find the easy things with, say, Google
[18:49] BruceF Wildcat: Isn't that what we want?
[18:49] Treblid Lassard: RL calls, thanks for the discussion everyone
[18:49] Lebachai Vesta: It's when Google fails, that's when people need us
[18:49] Lebachai Vesta: Thanks for coming, Treblid!
[18:49] Moonbeamdance Northmead: Sorry, have to leave too, thanks for the good info/ conversation.
[18:50] Lebachai Vesta: Bye!
[18:50] Bryndal Ellison accepted your inventory offer.
[18:50] Infinite Brevity: Funny you should mention failure, we've spent the last 5 days without our library system
[18:50] Willow Kindley: is endeca similar to what talis is doing? or am i really off-base?
[18:50] Infinite Brevity: Try answering questions with no catalog at all. :)
[18:50] Lebachai Vesta: Why 5 days?
[18:50] Maxito Ricardo is Offline
[18:51] Uskala Hidayat: Endeca was developed by the DSA and licensed to public and commercial users.
[18:51] Infinite Brevity: University IT in charge of hardware. Backup server was in same room with main server. Doh
[18:51] Willow Kindley: omg! we had our internet access go down for half a day and it was a real challenge.
[18:51] Elaine Tulip: if anyone here is involved in a K-12/university collaboration to promote tech use for teens, pls contact me...we have a YALSA Teen Tech Week program forSL coming up Mar 7
[18:51] Lebachai Vesta: ouch, Infinite
[18:51] JayBee Mayo: Glad we got our server back in the library! Took a while, but we managed it somehow.
[18:52] Lebachai Vesta: I'd like to start wrapping up...if you had to list the top 5-10 things that have changed b/c of technology in your libraries, what would they be?
[18:52] Dinnie Devonshire: Customer relations
[18:52] Uskala Hidayat: Need for learning clusters.
[18:52] Glen Yao: need for more information , faster
[18:52] Max Batra: customer expectations
[18:52] Elaine Tulip: tidal wave of information, not always managaed well by students
[18:52] JayBee Mayo: Expect that Google answers everything, well.
[18:52] Infinite Brevity: Training (Users and employees)
[18:52] Elaine Tulip: less books in collections, more computers
[18:53] Glen Yao: larger knowledge gap
[18:53] Sharkie Carmona: evaluating information not necessarily selected by a librarian
[18:53] Uskala Hidayat: A library is a process, not a building.
[18:53] Dinnie Devonshire: Budgets :)
[18:53] Khashai Steinbeck is Offline
[18:53] ambiant Kukulcan is Offline
[18:53] Infinite Brevity: Good one Dinnie
[18:53] Sharkie Carmona: Budgets squared!
[18:53] Ilene Pratt: Figuring out that even electronic resources need managing!
[18:54] Lebachai Vesta: Staff skillsets
[18:54] John2 Kepler is Offline
[18:54] JayBee Mayo: The old American thought that everything should be quick and easy - I see a lot of that
[18:54] Brielle Coronet is Offline
[18:54] Sharkie Carmona: How to keep staff trained
[18:54] Glen Yao: need for IT staff, not just someone with a hobby
[18:54] Dinnie Devonshire: Collaboration with peers has increased
[18:54] Lebachai Vesta: Amen to that Glen
[18:54] Dinnie Devonshire: In effect, the world has grown smaller
[18:55] Loki Mahana is Online
[18:55] Elaine Tulip: globalized, too
[18:55] Sharkie Carmona: And flatter
[18:55] Dinnie Devonshire: yes, flatter
[18:55] Ilene Pratt: Espeially in SL! This world is flat, isn't it?
[18:55] Lebachai Vesta: This has been a great (and enlightening!) discussion, folks...does anybody have any suggestions for further IT-related topics?
[18:55] Sharkie Carmona: Ans what about the "long tail" as applied to libraries
[18:55] Glen Yao: perceptually small , but intellectually larger
[18:56] Uskala Hidayat: Yes, the "long tail" vs. the 80-20 rule.
[18:56] Glen Yao: ????
[18:56] Lebachai Vesta: That would be a nifty topic, Uskala
[18:56] Willow Kindley: i guess we attract the long tail by inviting their participation.
[18:56] Lebachai Vesta: Do you want to elaborate a little for folks who aren't familiar with those ideas?
[18:56] BruceF Wildcat: Be happy to come back and chat about our new cert in digital information management and curation ;)
[18:56] Uskala Hidayat: But no furries allow.
[18:57] John2 Kepler is Online
[18:57] Uskala Hidayat: Netflix's business model is based on the "long tail"
[18:57] Ilene Pratt: Digital curation is a great term!
[18:57] BruceF Wildcat: IMLS thought so when they put out the call for grant apps ;)
[18:58] Willow Kindley: http://www.dlib.org/dlib/april06/dempsey/04dempsey.html
[18:58] Ilene Pratt: Tee hee! There's something about it that makes me want to become a vegetarian ;)
[18:58] Sharkie Carmona: Here is the book: The long tail : why the future of business is selling less of more / Title (2006) & the annotation Anderson presents a discussion about the economics of abundance--the rise of the niche--as the cost of reaching consumers drops dramatically and markets shift.
[18:58] Willow Kindley: http://www.techsource.ala.org/blog/2006/07/the-long-tail-wags-the-dog.html
[18:58] BruceF Wildcat: There is a digital curation symposium at NC state in april. I think 3 LIS schools got grants to develop curriculum.
[18:58] Uskala Hidayat: Good reference.
[18:59] Glen Yao: AH I understand it now, read somehting abotu that
[18:59] John2 Kepler is Offline
[18:59] Lebachai Vesta: Ok, then it sounds like it would a topic of interest
[18:59] Glen Yao: definitly
[18:59] Lebachai Vesta: I will go ahead and schedule that as our next group discussion
[18:59] Ilene Pratt: Thanks Lebachai!
[18:59] Lebachai Vesta: We'll also have another regular meeting of the IT Staff group soon
[18:59] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] Lebachai Vesta: If you are not a member of the group and would like to be, please feel free to join via Search or to IM me for an invite
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] BellTowerv.2 shouts: Gong
[19:00] Lebachai Vesta: Thanks to everyone for coming out tonight!
[19:00] Infinite Brevity: Great conversation tonight
[19:00] Donut Plate (L): Yum ! Sugar-glazed, Dinnie Devonshire, always great with coffee !
[19:00] Glen Yao: thanks for the meeting
[19:00] Lebachai Vesta: Thanks for the donuts!
[19:00] Glen Yao: NP
[19:00] Dinnie Devonshire: Yum!
[19:00] Ilene Pratt: Bye!
[19:00] Uskala Hidayat: Thanks you for being our MC
[19:00] Lebachai Vesta: Bye Ilene
[19:00] Lebachai Vesta: yw, Uskala
[19:00] Dinnie Devonshire: Thanks, Lebachai
[19:00] Glen Yao: please take one to go:)
[19:01] Abbey Zenith: Great meeting, thanks Lebachai
[19:01] Sharkie Carmona: Thanks to all, buona notte
[19:01] Liatris Tidewater: thanks, hope to make it earlier next time
[19:01] Dinnie Devonshire: Bye folks. See y'all soon.
[19:01] Willow Kindley: thank you. great conversation.
[19:01] BruceF Wildcat: so long.
[19:01] Lebachai Vesta: G'night all
[19:02] Infinite Brevity: night
[19:02] Abbey Zenith is Offline
[19:02] Max Batra: night
[19:02] You: Goodnight, everyone!
[19:04] Milosun Czervik is Offline